Missouri approves same-sex marriage ban

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This is how it should be decided. By the people not a bunch of left wing activist judges


http://us.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/08/04/samesex.marriage.ap/index.html

JEFFERSON CITY, Missouri (AP) -- Missouri voters solidly endorsed a state constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriage, a decision that was closely watched by national groups on both sides of the battle.

With nearly all precincts reporting, the amendment had garnered 71 percent of the vote, according to unofficial results for Tuesday's vote.

It was the first such vote since the historic ruling in Massachusetts last year that legalized same-sex weddings there.

Also Tuesday, Missouri voters dumped embattled Gov. Bob Holden in favor of state Auditor Claire McCaskill in the state's Democratic primary. (Full story)

Although the ban was widely expected to pass in conservative Missouri, experts said the campaign served as a key barometer for which strategies work as at least nine other states, and perhaps as many as 12, vote on similar amendments this year.

Missouri and 37 other states already have laws defining marriage as only between a man and a woman. But amendment supporters fear a court could toss aside the state law, and they believe the state would be on firmer legal ground if an outright ban is part of the Constitution.

"I'm very gratified and encouraged and thankful that the people of this state understand our current policy's a wise public policy and they want to see it protected from a legal challenge," said Vicky Hartzler, a spokeswoman for the Coalition to Protect Marriage in Missouri.

Opponents said the amendment was unnecessary and discriminatory, but knew they faced an uphill battle in Missouri.

"We're already reaching out to these other states, sharing with them what we learned, what worked, what didn't work, and we'll move on," said Doug Gray, campaign manager for the Constitution Defense League. "Ultimately we're right and they're simply wrong."

Supporters and opponents of the amendment have used grassroots campaigns, knocking on doors and making phone calls to tell people about the issue. The group fighting the amendment, the Constitution Defense League, raised more than $360,000, largely from national gay-rights groups, and ran a television ad in the final days before the vote.

The group favoring the amendment, the Coalition to Protect Marriage in Missouri, spread the word through churches and community events, raising just a few thousand dollars but saying public sentiment in Missouri was on their side.

Louisiana residents are to vote on a marriage amendment September 18. Then Arkansas, Georgia, Kentucky, Mississippi, Montana, Oklahoma, Oregon and Utah are to vote on the issue November 2. Initiatives are pending in Michigan, North Dakota and Ohio.

Four states -- Alaska, Hawaii, Nebraska and Nevada -- already have similar amendments in their constitutions.
 

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Must be nice to live in a free state where you get to vote on such matters, rather than liberal judges playing King and forcing it down your throat then make you subsidize it at gun point like Assachussets.
 

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Why would you oppose judges making these decisions? Isn't marriage a legal state of being? Isn't the idea of right-wing politics to keep the gov't out of your bedrooms? The state should have diddly to do with marriage, IMO.

Besides, I wonder how much different your opinions would be if these left-wing lunatic activists judges were right-wing anti-gay activist judges instead.
 

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Some people would argue that if one was living in a free state, then one would decide on an individual basis by marriage as to who one would want to marry, or if one even wants to get married at all.....

The "liberal judges playing king" would appear to be leaving that choice up to the individual,and consenting individuals, creating liberty for both the liberals and the conservatives, to choose the path of thier own destiny....

Conservatives generally only feel thier freedom is at stake when laws are enacted that pose a direct, iminent threat to thier own personal life or lifestyle, whereas liberals look at the picture as a whole and tend to see that restrictions upon one group of people are an erosion of rights for everyone....

Nice to see that in light of the fact and burden of an evergrowing national debt and budget deficits, that there is time to waste more money and effort on pursuits like these, that have little if no effect on society or how people live thier individual or married lives as compared to people whose moral lifestyle they may or may not agree with...
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>xpanda: Besides, I wonder how much different your opinions would be if these left-wing lunatic activists judges were right-wing anti-gay activist judges instead. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

2 wrongs don't make a right. I rather see a law made by 70% of the people than by 4 left wing liberal judges. The people do not want gay marriages why should a ruling of 4 judges over rule that.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Marco: The "liberal judges playing king" would appear to be leaving that choice up to the individual,and consenting individuals, creating liberty for both the liberals and the conservatives, to choose the path of thier own destiny <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

So let's start legalising drugs, legalise marriage of 5 men and 1 woman, father and daughter, son and mom, brother and sister. What a nice healthy society we will have.
 

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Patroit, no one is forcing anything down your throat - I take it that your a strong heterosexual all-american guy - this law only applies to fags - you not being a fruit, then this law has ZERO effect on you either way - with or without marriage you can still get married if you'd like - of course if your a miserable person with a miserable life and a miserable family and a miserable job and consequently you are full of anger and hatred well than I understand your need to stay up all night freaking out over what the two queers down the street are doing.
 

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But, truth, don't judges make decisions in the absence of mass voting all the time? Isn't that kinda their job? My point is simply that the state has no role in this issue. The state in almost every nation has at some time usurped authority where marriage is concerned in an effort to control the population in way or another. While I don't disagree with you that referendums are the best example of democracy at work, I don't buy the argument that judges cannot make legal judgements but the state certainly can. There is no logic in that.

As for your statement that two wrongs don't make a right in this case, it doesn't apply here. I'm talking about what I perceive to be hypocrisy. If judges said 'no' to SSM, as some of them have, the right are elated, as they have been here as well. It's ridiculous. This isn't about judges making the decision, but about judges making a decision you don't like.

SSM has been legal in Ontario for over a year now. I challenge anyone here to point out any detrimental effects on our society that it is having or has had, and to keep me posted of any detrimental effects it has in the future.
 

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TT....I will admit I'm not a drug user, can pass any drug test any day of the week, and submit any hair samples for testing, and absolutely pass....I would admit also that I am for legalizing drugs, because the current policy of outlawing drugs has clearly shown to not work, one can simply compare the case of prohibition of alcohol to the current war on drugs, and quickly come to the realization that billions of dollars are being wasted trying to protect people from themselves, and in fact creating a untaxed black market and numerous other actual crimes against other parties uninvolved with the drug trade.....these criminal activities and organizations would dissipate with legalization and regulation of drugs.

The groups that would object the most to the legalization of drugs would be the gangs and drug dealers, and organized crime groups, because under legalization thier profits would disappear......How many local bookies are losing income because thier bettors found computers and started playing offshore?

When you say...."What a nice healthy society we will have"......that's exactly why inbreeding is deemed unacceptable, because of all the oddities inbreeding creates.....What two separate, unrelated strangers do is quite a different story.....if they want to get married, SO WHAT! It won't effect my life any, why should I or anyone else for that matter have any right to tell anyone how they should live thier life as long as it doesn't harm my person or property?
 

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Xpanda, yes, that is how laws are implemented in the country - legislative bodies make laws - if people think they are unfair they challenge them - courts determine the constitutionality of the law - rednecks showing up at a local gym to vote does not create a law - if these people are unhappy vote for people you want in office who will implement laws you favor - BUT WITHOUT A FEDERAL CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT the law is always subject to the discretion of the courts - eventually, all this will be decided by the Supreme Court unless Farwell, I mean Bush, gets a constitutional amendment passed.
 

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To me the issue isn't gay marriage, it's the gay agenda.

Prior to this, I was always of the opinion that what I don't know won't hurt me; especially when it's happening behind closed doors.

Then I recognized that some of those homosexuals are pediphiles wrapped in homsexual clothing to hide their own agenda (see the Catholic Church pediphile problem if you don't know what I mean).

Anyway, I've determined that marriage is between a man and a woman for purposes of procreation. Homosexuals, by their nature, can't have kids.

The homosexuals want full social acceptance of their lifestyles - at the point of a cops gun if need be. I disagree - and I believe that most people agree with me - they just don't say so publicly because a loud cry of "homophobe" would be levelled at them.

Go for civil unions and I'll agree. I'll agree to benmefits - they are deserved, just as in a marriage.
Go for adoption with periodic checks (because there are a lot of pediphiles who'd love to marry as homosexuals and adopt a little boy)
But I will not agree to homosexuals being married!

Let it come to a vote of the people, and 70% will vote against the homsexuals - everytime and everyplace.
 

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I read a study recently that claimed that 20% of all pedophiles are homosexuals. Well, that's pretty freaking alarming, isn't it?? It is, until you realise that by deduction, 80% of pedophiles were NOT homosexuals, so were, presumably heterosexuals.

So, what is the correlation of homosexual marriage and pedophilia exactly?? Does letting two gay men get married somehow endorse or encourage pedophelia?? How do civil unions NOT encourage pedophilia, comparatively, that allows you to endorse that idea?

There is positively no rational basis for disallowing two same sex individuals to get married other than bigotry, ignorance, fear or hatred. Fine if you fit into one of these camps, but just admit to it rather than flaunting bogus correlations and unjustifiable claims.
 

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Xpanda, I won't get into your silly comment bigotry, hatred, ignorance or fear is the reason why people oppose gay marriage...you should however realize that the majority of voters that shot down the gay marriage proposal in Missouri were democrats; about 800,000 Dems voted in yesterday's election compared to about 600,000 GOPers.

Most people in both parties, including Kerry and Bush, oppose gay marriage. Mayby those supporting it should bring better arguments rather than dismissing the opponents as ignorant and bigots.
 

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The whole point of my post was to show that those 4 judges took it upon themselves to rewrite the definition of marriage bypassing the legistlatures and the electorate and in some case 5000 years of religious tradition.
Knowing full well it would never fly anyway.
The traditional definition of marriage is Man and woman.
Calling tommorow August 5th, the 4th of July, does not make it so.
Calling a monkey a parrot does not make it so.
Calling up, down does not make it so.
Making new rules out of whole cloth from legistlative law to turn an election (see fla supreme court 2000)... does not make it so. Thank god for the US supreme court 2000, to tell them that.

I personally could care less about what gays do.It has nothing to do with that.
Except maybe I wish lesbians would be more inclusive when it came to me, Cause I'm a lesbian too.
 

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All you right wing homophobes are for a fvcking amendment that bans freedoms. You fvcks are more anti american than Al Queda.
 

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Hey Poopsie,

I really love my two dogs...is it okay if I marry them?
 

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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by xpanda:
SSM has been legal in Ontario for over a year now. I challenge anyone here to point out any detrimental effects on our society that it is having or has had, and to keep me posted of any detrimental effects it has in the future. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I understand it may have detrimental effects on the parties involved since same sex divorce has not yet become available.
 

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Woody,

They're already trying the same sex divorce in the U.S. There's a couple of whackos who recently got married and are now getting divorced one week later in an effort to stir up the pot.
 

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The same sex divorce story is from a Canadien couple if it matters to anyone. They are a threat to the sanctity of divorce:

Lesbians launch Canada's first same-sex divorce
Wed 21 July, 2004 18:46

TORONTO (Reuters) - Two Canadian women who were among the first same-sex couples to get legally married, may become the first same-sex couple in Canada to get a divorce.

The two, who decided to call it quits after getting married last summer, are trying to get the country's Divorce Act amended so they can go their separate ways, a lawyer for one of the women said on Wednesday.

Julie Hannaford said the case may be the first same-sex divorce petition in Canada, where gay marriage is legal in some provinces.

"Under the Divorce Act, a court can only dissolve a marriage between a man and a woman," Hannaford said.

The couple are asking the Ontario Superior Court of Justice to grant them a divorce and deem the Divorce Act's definition of spouse -- "of a man or woman who are married to each other" -- unconstitutional. The petition asks the court to order the phrase "to each other" be dropped.

"If that doesn't happen, it is not possible for same-sex couples to divorce," Hannaford said.

"That is their dilemma. They are married, they both want to have their marriage dissolved and they both want to get on with their lives, and right now, they can't."

The two women were married just days after a landmark Ontario court decision in June 2003 opened the door to same-sex marriages. But after a five-year relationship, the marriage lasted only five days before they separated.

The court has ordered the names of the two women be kept secret because one, identified only as M.M., has "serious concerns about embarrassment and emotional distress" if her name were known.

"There is a certain stigma associated with being ... the first gay or lesbian couple to divorce," according to court documents filed by M.M.'s lawyer.

Hannaford represents the other woman in the case, J.H.

Canada has become North America's leader in gay weddings since courts in Ontario, Quebec, British Columbia and Yukon ruled it was unconstitutional to ban same-sex couples from getting married.

The Supreme Court of Canada will examine the gay marriage issue in the fall to determine whether same-sex unions must be permitted constitutionally.
 

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Senditin,

I could truly give a shit if you want fvck your two dogs all night. To each his own.
 

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